In response to Elizabeth's comment here i thought i would open up this questio  for discussion:

What is Spam?

To me spam has a broad definition:

any unwanted, unexpected advertising that has not been requested or part of a service (so for example i don't think comercials on TV are spam because they are part of  the "package"- i know that if i want to watch TV i will be subected to commercials)

Sounds about right to me....

1. Email spam - unwanted, requested, non opt-in email ads
2. Forum Spam - wel ya'll Admins/Mods know that one
3. Blog comment spam - if have a Blog U know this one
4. SMM  Spam - spamming various social media ssite profiles
5. Web Spam - MFA (and related) sites that are auto generated and link spam their way to top SERPs (uselss sites)

Anything else?

web related marketing that is for self-gain only, plus any (or none) of the following

- against the rules (eg link drops on this forum)
- obstructive to course of flow
- has malicious intent
- is automised / mass produced
- is not personalised but completely indiscriminate (goes hand in hand with the automated idea)

Think of our friends over at syndk8, what would they say?

Couldn't one also argue

"I know that if I post my email address, I will be subjected to emails trying to sell me stuff ?"

Here's what bugs me, I go to the movies and pay way to much $ to watch the movie and way to much $ to buy the popcorn, and sit down and see car commercials...Is this spam?  I didn't expect it, I don't think it's part of the package.

I found an interesting form that included "uninteresting posts" in there defintion of spam..I suspect they will soon ban me ;-)

Northie wrote:

web related marketing that is for self-gain only, plus any (or none) of the following

- against the rules (eg link drops on this forum)
- obstructive to course of flow
- has malicious intent
- is automised / mass produced
- is not personalised but completely indiscriminate (goes hand in hand with the automated idea)

Think of our friends over at syndk8, what would they say?

He he... they'd say it's all in a days work, though they get pissed when some one spams the forum.... ha ha ha....

So they'd say -

Link Spam/Web Spam = Revenues
SEO = Search Engine Oportunist

Hiya,

not been here for a while

Spam comes in all shapes, forms and guises.

I think that if you take each of gypsys points and multiply them by N's points you get a very good answer





I also think ER has her knickers in a twist over this 'over genralisation of spam' thing. I also think she has too strong a personal opnion to voice it all here; have been reading some of her other posts too am surprised pmemebrs have stood for it; or is that why TA tried to leave?

/rant

Angel Eyes wrote:

I also think ER has her knickers in a twist over this 'over genralisation of spam' thing. I also think she has too strong a personal opnion to voice it all here; have been reading some of her other posts too am surprised pmemebrs have stood for it; or is that why TA tried to leave?

/rant

http://www.conceptart.org/forums/images … _devil.gif

Hiya Angel .. great to cya again..... and yeah, TA ain't proly her biggest fan. Personally, she can say what she pleases as can I.... it is a public forum and I would hate to see it over-moderated. She is simply a little bit too passionate about SR as a noob.... but maybe that's why, give her a year and see if she still has that... I used to bitch about the 'perosnal stuff' ... but gave it up.

As a mod, i'll say this:

Strong views are fine as long as they don't go against the rules
Strong views that are backed up are very useful to everyone

Flaming will not be tolerated

Spam will not be tolerated either

Personally, spam is anything online that is unwanted and gets in my way!

oh yeah, i forgot this one - www.spam.com

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spam

Northie wrote:

As a mod, i'll say this:

Strong views are fine as long as they don't go against the rules
Strong views that are backed up are very useful to everyone

Flaming will not be tolerated

Spam will not be tolerated either

Personally, spam is anything online that is unwanted and gets in my way!

The rules???? Hmmmmm...guess I am gonna have to go....

We ask that members do not post links to their own website within the body of their posts. Links to your website are only allowed within your profile and your signature.

I make references to various writings of mine all the time.... DAMMIT!!!... guess ya better ban me huh Mod man?

Northie wrote:

Personally, spam is anything online that is unwanted and gets in my way!

Please remind me to not get in your way :-)

Who decides what is 'unwanted'? - democracy?...Wait ! that's what we need a social spam voting service, vote for the worst spam, and then it gets removed....

And what about phone spam?  No I don't want a credit card with a low introductory rate, your welcome that I donated to your organization last year (though I don't remember it), and yes I have life insurance. Thank-you

Hmmm.. Would a "do not call list" work for email?

Hoping this post is wanted and not getting in the way ;-)

TheGypsy wrote:

We ask that members do not post links to their own website within the body of their posts. Links to your website are only allowed within your profile and your signature.

I make references to various writings of mine all the time.... DAMMIT!!!... guess ya better ban me huh Mod man?

Links to other websites are allowed only if they are appropriate to the conversation at hand.

I see this as members linking to pages that provide a useful insight to the topic of conversation, be it their own or not

Hello all,

Thanks for the compliments...


I would like to see the rules be rewritten to have clearer procedures. I notice they they are a left-over from the old administrator as well.

As a noob (as Dave so eloquently put it,) I did not understand what a 'signature' was when I first came here. I could have inadvertently used it in my post without realizing where the signature panel actually was.....just due to inexperience (and maybe something to do with my knickers as well).

I actually made a post requesting this action to be taken several days ago and was cautioned by one of the moderators...(but promptly deleted it after his PM) his words were...

"Many in here have been around the block more than once and have a keep eye for it. We can also tell the difference between an innocent mistake and an intentional one.

I would like to know how you can tell the difference between the innocent mistake and the intentional one? Do you have a system in place that determines this? I would like simply like to know?

Elizabeth Richardson

P.S. ...just off to change those uncomfortable knickers now ...ouch!...

TheGypsy wrote:

I make references to various writings of mine all the time.... DAMMIT!!!... guess ya better ban me huh Mod man?

i think this depends on the context in which the linkdrop takes places...if we're having a discussion on "whether or not submitting your site to se's is a healthy way to get indexed" for example and there's a resource on your site that's adds relevant and positive value to the conversation then that's acceptable to point to it

however if we're having the same conversation and  I junp in and say "Hey I'm giving away FREE Ice Cream on my website here check it out : www.FreeIceCream.com" then it's not


edit: looks like we responded at the same time N...and with about the same thoughts

elizabethrichardson wrote:

I would like to see the rules be rewritten to have clearer procedures.

i'd like to have a crystal clear set of rules as well and that’s something i hope we do one day but i do have a lot of work  and while this is in the pile it hasn't made it to the top yet...not the greatest excuse but the honest one

if anyone is ever unsure on how to proceed please PM me or any of the mods/admins and I'll be happy to point you in the right direction

Northie wrote:

TheGypsy wrote:

We ask that members do not post links to their own website within the body of their posts. Links to your website are only allowed within your profile and your signature.

I make references to various writings of mine all the time.... DAMMIT!!!... guess ya better ban me huh Mod man?

Links to other websites are allowed only if they are appropriate to the conversation at hand.

I see this as members linking to pages that provide a useful insight to the topic of conversation, be it their own or not

Yeah.. I know there muppet.... ( my best Earl immitation) .... Just having some fun M8.

Lizzy, I think it is certainly experience that can help one to know what is and isn't Spam on a forum. As far as innocent mistakes, I would have to say it's nearly obvious. A person making a lengthy post, actively being involved in oter threads is likely made a simple mistake.... Real forum spam is usually some one with a few posts (if not a single post) that put's in an obvious attempt to garner traffic (link love) from their action.

i think this depends on the context in which the linkdrop takes places...if we're having a discussion on "whether or not submitting your site to se's is a healthy way to get indexed" for example and there's a resource on your site that's adds relevant and positive value to the conversation then that's acceptable to point to it

See above .... for me it is simply to save time. That's part of why I started writing in the first place. I kept running into the same questions over and over and figured if I wrote about it, I could save time answering by simply referring to a writing on the topic. It is also often how I decide WHAT to write about.

elizabethrichardson wrote:

Hello all,

Thanks for the compliments...


I would like to see the rules be rewritten to have clearer procedures. I notice they they are a left-over from the old administrator as well.

As a noob (as Dave so eloquently put it,) I did not understand what a 'signature' was when I first came here. I could have inadvertently used it in my post without realizing where the signature panel actually was.....just due to inexperience (and maybe something to do with my knickers as well).

I actually made a post requesting this action to be taken several days ago and was cautioned by one of the moderators...(but promptly deleted it after his PM) his words were...

"Many in here have been around the block more than once and have a keep eye for it. We can also tell the difference between an innocent mistake and an intentional one.

I would like to know how you can tell the difference between the innocent mistake and the intentional one? Do you have a system in place that determines this? I would like simply like to know?

Elizabeth Richardson

P.S. ...just off to change those uncomfortable knickers now ...ouch!...

ER, thats a quite a bit of spin, you questioned a snipped link and I responded (below are a few responses) but never did I caution or request that you modify or delete your post.

WS "ER, When a noob poster drops a link that has no relevance to the topic it is considered spam. Many in here have been around the block more than once and have a keep eye for it. We can also tell the difference between an innocent mistake and an intentional one."

WS "I doubt that was an inavertent link, I googled the name and the poster is up to no good, they are spamming the crap out of forums. So there was some thought placed behind it."

Angel Eyes wrote:

or is that why TA tried to leave?

Nah -- I didn't try to leave; just stepped away for awhile as I've got other things on my plate ... so, I guess I'll leave my Spam...

http://www.govtrav.net/site%20reference.jpg

TA wrote:

Angel Eyes wrote:

or is that why TA tried to leave?

Nah -- I didn't try to leave; just stepped away for awhile as I've got other things on my plate ... so, I guess I'll leave my Spam...

http://www.govtrav.net/site%20reference.jpg

Now, I'm going to leave that in, others may disagree, but lets look at my reasons

1 - it's a link to a graphic, that is relevant to SR. We did hold a logo competition once
2 - TA is not looking for SEO credence
  2a - no keyword in link
  2b - nothing to index on the other end, no link ot the rest of his site

As we're in the mood of quoting rules, may I draw people's attention to this one

No Policing. Members should not enforce the rules on their own. If you see a violation of the rules, use the 'report' link which can be found at the bottom of every post.

As for spam - the detection is as follows

users of the forum can report suspicious activity
the owners, admins and mods can report suspicious activity

owners, admins and mods review all complaints and using their experience, own judgment and discussions with each other to determine the outcome.

This may be an open forum, but it's still privately owned and could ban me at ant time or even remove the forum from the web. I have always respected the owners of this forum, and get slightly frustrated when other's don't.

Northie wrote:

This may be an open forum, but it's still privately owned and could ban me at ant time or even remove the forum from the web. I have always respected the owners of this forum, and get slightly frustrated when other's don't.

Northie...I appreciate how clearly you communicate...the signs of a great leader.

I shall take this as valuable feedback and learn my lessons accordingly.

I still feel for any of the people who may have been innocent victims to the broadness of this policy.....I see how easily it could have happened to me.

As we have seen  by this discussion, people's definitions of spam are quite general and guided by personal opinion...and Northie, I respect you greatly, yet I cringed when you made the comment ...

Personally, spam is anything online that is unwanted and gets in my way!

...and know that this statement is just one example of how personal opinions can get in the way of a SOUND policy.

I do respect the owners of this forum and apologize for any disrespect that may have been shown by voicing my strong opinions, being inexperience or ignorant.

I look forward to seeing the rules and procedures for new members re-written to be much clearer. I also look forward to seeing the definition of 'spam' redefined.

Has anyone thought about the benefits of 'useful spam'...you know, the stuff on the odd occasions you receive that 'doesn't get in your way' but has still been unsolicited....?

This conversation has been immensely valuable to me and I appreciate being able to use this forum as a means to learn and grow and gain more experience.....OFF TOPIC (it's a pity I don't really wear knickers or I may have actually been able to use that as an excuse)

Kindest wishes to everyone,

Elizabeth Richardson

P.S. I also appreciate that several of the administrators have very gently reminded me of the policies on occasions, as I have a tendency to 'get on my high horse' and forget them...but I'm sure you already know that about me.