#1 2006-07-17 14:49:53
- cooljools
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Just arrived off Noah's Ark
Outworn, outdated webmaster here, realizing, “Oh my goodness, look at all the dust and cobwebs in my code”. I designed my web site “back in the day...”’ You can now see it in the Museum of Natural History, along with all the other fossils…. though, of course, my web site is still on the net....
I’d figured I had mastered the basics of HTML back in the late 90’s, so that was that,... I’m done, right? Uhhhh, ... WRONG.
XML came along, and I thought “to heck with it”, I can still see my web site on the internet. Looks good. So why should I care?
Then came CSS, and I thought “why hassle”?
And now we have RDF, and URI’s, and a lot of other coding that I’m unfamiliar with.
Then I read from this SR article, http://www.site-reference.com/articles/ … Keywords”. It is not about getting an “A” on your report card from overbearing, code-writing snobs. A quote from the article:
“However, HTML has one striking drawback. HTML defines where to place what content on a site page, but it can’t discern relationships between the content, or how it could be used to provide more valuable results to user queries. That’s why SEs exist in the first place – to try to develop 100% relevancy in a world with ‘too much’ information.”
For ex., in my retail web site, I have almost 100 vintage jewelry items made by Trifari for sale. But the SE’s weren’t indexing these Trifari pages. My web site has longevity and a PR of 5, so why weren’t my sub-pages ranking above 3 in Google? Because G’s spider can’t read content.
So, I conclude that getting an “A” on your report card means being up-to-date & W3C compliant. Now I see why:
"Because the semantics are getting better…."
If you're like me, a card-carrying dinosaur, you might want to read this article.
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#2 2006-07-17 16:24:55
- Tink
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Re: Just arrived off Noah's Ark
Interesting read, but I have a couple of semantical points, ironically enough.
It stands for HyperText Markup Language and it’s the accepted programming code
HTML isn't a programming code, it is a layout or templating code.
HTML places content, makes it interactive with web users and provides site navigation via coded links.
HTML isn't interactive in and of itself. You can make it interactive with Javascript, CSS (to a limited extent, looks really neat though), or a programming language like .NET or php.
Just nitpicking really, but the rest was a good read.
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#3 2006-07-17 16:45:10
- matte
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Re: Just arrived off Noah's Ark
The author implies SE cannot differentiate between code and content.
Do we really think that with the milllions invested by the SE that they cannot?
Of course they can
Another article by elitists. I gave it a 2
Borne out by poorly coded sites doing just as well as 100% wc3 compliant.
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#4 2006-07-17 17:09:38
- cooljools
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Re: Just arrived off Noah's Ark
Really?
PHEW!!!!
I can go back to my couch now, and be a potato again.....
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#5 2006-07-17 19:51:06
- Mutilated1
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Re: Just arrived off Noah's Ark
The author implies SE cannot differentiate between code and content.
Do we really think that with the milllions invested by the SE that thety cannot?
Of course thaey can
they sure can - its just a matter of a few regular expressions to strip everything but the text, and you can find the code already written if you just look for it. its not even a very big program
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#6 2006-07-17 20:15:33
- mark
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Re: Just arrived off Noah's Ark
I think the point of the article was that properly coded content can help SE's, which I think is entirely true. I do not think that it is a necessity, but I do think it helps SE's in the long run. For example, we do know that SE's place some weight on h1 tags and subsequent 'h' tags - this is due to the semantic nature of the web.
Is a SE going to penalize you for poor or invalid code? No. Does this mean that this doesn't play into your ranking. Absolutely not.
Keep in mind that there are literally hundreds of factors that play into your ranking. A properly coded site could in theory be interpreted better by an SE while that same SE ranks a poorly coded site above it. I think the thing to point out is that code is not required for a good ranking...but SE's do pay attention, at least to some tags.
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#7 2006-07-17 23:26:37
- matte
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Re: Just arrived off Noah's Ark
I agree on the h tag aspect - but that is all about making it also presentable to humans as well.
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#8 2006-07-17 23:33:55
- Webgaya
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Re: Just arrived off Noah's Ark
Here is a tool to try,
http://www.seochat.com/seo-tools/spider-simulator/
It nicely strips out HTML and shows what SE spiders
may see when they crawl a certain URL.
webgaya.
No Matter Which Keyword Service You Use, You Will Still Need This Free Tool
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#9 2006-07-18 00:25:16
- mark
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Re: Just arrived off Noah's Ark
matte wrote:
I agree on the h tag aspect - but that is all about making it also presentable to humans as well.
Proper use of HTML tags will do that. If you use HTML semantics properly, most browsers will interpret HTML in a way that helps the user.
For example, a good HTML tag to know would be the <acronym> tag. Used properly, the acronym tag can assist in telling your users what a specific acronym stands for. So <acronym title="World Wide Web">WWW</acronym> would show a slightly dotted line under WWW with a popup when you hover over it that displays the definition of WWW.
The argument of using semantics for SE's almost always ties in with making your site more usable overall.
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#10 2006-07-19 00:41:18
- mark
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Re: Just arrived off Noah's Ark
As a very interesting add-on to this discussion. Peter Norvig, Google Director of Search, had this to say about using the semantic web for search:
"What I get a lot is: 'Why are you against the Semantic Web?' I am not against the Semantic Web. But from Google's point of view, there are a few things you need to overcome, incompetence being the first," Norvig said. Norvig clarified that it was not Berners-Lee or his group that he was referring to as incompetent, but the general user.
"We deal with millions of Web masters who can't configure a server, can't write HTML. It's hard for them to go to the next step. The second problem is competition. Some commercial providers say, 'I'm the leader. Why should I standardize?' The third problem is one of deception. We deal every day with people who try to rank higher in the results and then try to sell someone Viagra when that's not what they are looking for. With less human oversight with the Semantic Web, we are worried about it being easier to be deceptive," Norvig said.
Google Exec Challenges Berners-Lee
Don't know if this answers the debate, but it seems to me like a semantic web is the direction that people want to go, but SE operators are hesitant due to what they perceive as incompetence.
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